A new Board rule targeting rental owners

9/26/2021 28 Comments

A new Board rule targeting rental owners

A new rule out for review will give the the HOA the power to shut down homeowners who have rental properties with any outstanding fines or assessments.

The board has scheduled a special open meeting on Thursday, September 30th at 9:00 am ,in the Masters Lounge, to allow homeowners to
speak in the open session before they vote to accept, reject or modify this new proposed rule.

This raises a few questions that the board needs to address at the Board Meeting:

Why did the board feel that it needed to single out Rentals Owners?

Do rental owners represent a higher risk of not paying their fines?

Do homeowners with rentals represent a higher Collection risk?

If the Bylaws allow rentals, how can the HOA write new rules to shutdown rentals?

Attend the meeting in person or through the Zoom application and see if these questions are answered.

The blog would like to hear your thoughts.

28 Comments

steven

9/26/2021 11:04:02 pm

This ruling came down on August 20th with respect to an HOA's ability to limit short term rentals and may affect the HOA's abilty to impose this new rule on anyone who is already and owner.

https://www.bbklaw.com/news-events/insights/2021/legal-alerts/09/common-interest-developments-may-not-impose-post

D C

10/28/2021 07:56:00 pm

To add wo Steven's comments:
Anyone that has owned property at the Desert Princess prior to the new "rental rules" should demand a refund of their rental fee. The rental fee represents a restriction on the proprietary rights, and it is expressly prohibited by Civil Code section 4740. Furthermore, Civil Code section 4741 exposes the HOA to a civil fine of up to $1000.00 of having a rule that restricts rentals in a CID. Failure to comply with Section 4741 may result in a HOA being liable for actual damages (e.g., lost rental income) and a civil penalty of up to one thousand dollars ($1,000). All these issues have been adjudicated in Brown vs. Montage at Mission Hills, and the DPCC HOA knew or should have known that the new "rental rules" may result in a liability of possibly more than $250K

Marianne Thomas link

10/29/2021 07:17:48 am

What they have done is fabricated by a group of people, who basically control the board and its actions. Just as they were hysterical about feeling personally threatened by the issues raised by those in opposition to them at a meeting, they have taken on what exists in other properties and connected the happenings to the DP.
If there is a legal ruling that prevents what the are doing re: rentals....what can be done?

Desert Princess Investments LLC

9/27/2021 12:49:57 am

Makes no sense. Is discriminatory. A question: do rentals of Arroyo villas cause more complaints and calls to security than do original condos? What is the data on this?

karen

2/7/2022 11:03:47 am

DP cannot give us rental statistics of rental issues vs home owner issues. I have tried numerous times to get real numbers from the HOA and security. They want to give arbitrary numbers in % of what security problems are attributed to STRV's vs homeowner security calls. I have asked to see call logs, details, phone logs to no avail. And also what is the percentage of homeowners who have had numerous calls on their rentals and a are habitual offenders? Can't take anything that is said about this at face value as they have zero back up on "actual facts" Its like they have a agenda and getting rid of rentals and adding fines and "fees" are the norm now with Desert Princess. Its ridiculous and discriminatory. What happened to accountability

Marianne Thomas link

9/27/2021 06:20:56 am

This is the first I am hearing about this meeting.

Darn it! It’s not raining again! link

9/27/2021 07:16:01 am

What’s the problem here? Owners are fined/penalized if their renters don’t follow the rules. That is why there are RULES. I don’t believe that a different set of behaviors I spelled out for owners vs renters. The short term rentals are ridiculous. It is hardly ever a small family and their children. It is more often groups of younger people looking to have a big party weekend.

Walter

9/27/2021 10:12:56 am

Agreed. I would like to see data regarding security/police issues connected to short term rentals.

9/27/2021 03:35:22 pm

There is very little. You can contact the police department. They will tell you that the Desert Princess has very little negative activity. Some of the least of the neighborhoods in Cat City. Several homeowners have already contacted them for that information. 2 different police officers have been interviewed as has the head of their department.

David Abbott

9/27/2021 08:33:40 am

THIS IS RIDICULOUS..

Tmsr

9/27/2021 10:30:46 am

Look at the bigger picture. Recall current board and vote to change policies that are non discriminatory.

Paul

9/27/2021 01:19:45 pm

Agree. This specific issue aside- its becoming more like a prison. With the exception of a select few -we are the inmates.

Takis P Vartelas

9/27/2021 01:27:39 pm

I think that all people who rent their properties short or long term find an attorney that would file a lawsuit against the current board for harassing us and discriminating against us. Someone in that particular board has ill feeling against us and is using the board's "power" to get to us.
Let's fight back and sue the board and the individuals that come up with those rules. And let's not forget that some board members are not as others.
And I agree with TMSR. When we vote again, we need to be careful and vote for people that care about the community and do not discriminate against some of us.

Concerned STVR Owner

9/27/2021 01:30:17 pm

I just got notified that the "OPEN" board meeting this Thursday is a ZOOM only meeting. At last Friday's Board meeting, all the board
members discussed that they needed to be more transparent and have a better 2-way communications with the homeowners. Why did this change in 3 days?
In the last 3 months all homeowners have been able to choose to attend open Board meetings in person or on Zoom.

Why are the rules changing again? So much for open channels of communication. Many homeowners in the community feel that speaking in
the Masters Lounge is much more personal than talking to a computer. Is this being done so that the Board can again attempt to shut down all conversations that they are not comfortable with?

Now they won't let us in to speak. THHIS IS UNACCEPTABE. We all need to contact the HOA and let them them know that we DEMAND to be heard
in person. A board member on Friday offered to be there in person for the upcoming chat. Let him do so for this board meeting.

OPEN UP THE MASTERS LOUNGE TO YOUR FELLOW HOMEOWNERS

What An Exaggeration

9/27/2021 03:32:45 pm

Complete lies from Norm Stoehr in his message he sent out today.
"...a riotous mob, shouting, chanting, and intimidating peaceful fellow homeowners who were too unnerved to speak. "
Homeowners did not scare other homeowners off from speaking. The homeowners he is referencing welcomed and preferred other homeowners to speak!
It was the board that cut off homeowners from speaking because they did not like what some of the homeowners concerns were. Just like they always do. It was the board that stopped the homeowners from speaking.
And a little "recall, recall" chant in response to Peter Webb's demand to shut down the meeting in its entirety just because he didn't like some of the concerns voiced from some of the homeowners was a far cry from "riotous mob"!
No ones safety was threatened either. For Norm to state "Had I been in the room, instead of attending via Zoom, I would have feared for my safety." is completely ridiculous and way off base from the reality of 15 seconds of a vocalized "recall" and some clapping.
And yet again he is calling homeowners that are discontent with the board MALCONTENTS.
This attitude deserves a RECALL.

Takis P Vartelas

9/27/2021 02:59:55 pm

Hello Everyone
Did you see the last email from Norm?

This man continues to call many of us all kinds of names and "play the victim" by saying more or less that we are criminals and we plan to hurt him...!!!
Did he ever think that the behavior he blames homeowners of was energized by him?

But the disgusting part is when he wrote this. "I now appeal to your sense of decency, fair play, and civic duty"....!!!
And my question is, where is your "sense of decency, fair play, and civic duty" Norm? You have created a mess and you keep adding gasoline to the fire when in reality - as a board member - you should keep your comments to yourself and diffuse the situation by letting people VOTE and accept the outcome as they should.....!!!!

Hey Norm. I would like to inform you that I am NOT a part of a gang and also I was NOT part of that Zoom meeting last week. But I hope you have the decency to apologize for all those name calling because many of those names do not sit well with many of us no matter what the outcome of the vote will be.

I suggest you reconsider your behavior towards people who live in the same community.

And YES, I am a proud homeowner of The Desert Princess and you will NOT take this away from me by calling me names

Are You Kidding?

9/28/2021 06:29:14 am

DP's own Stormin' Norman does it again. In his latest rant, he references "restoring" civility and decorum to the community by voting no to recalling Webb. REALLY????? This from a man who as Board VP uses expressions like "riotous mob, malcontents and haters" to describe a significantl number of owners in DP simply because their views differ from the Board. This is one angry man that not only grossly misrepresented the events of Friday's meeting by wilfully omitting any reference to the ham-fisted attempt by Webb to shut down the meeting simply because he didn't care to entertain legitimate questions/concerns from several owners. The chants and clapping were the expected result of this attempt.

Mr. Stoehr's propaganda pieces circulating the community, written once by Stoehr the homeowner and this latest as an unpaid, volunteer Board member, only serves to beautifully illustrate why many owners closed ranks to try to put an end to this disgraceful behavior by DP leadership.

Ol timer

9/28/2021 08:19:47 am

Great idea we need more accountability.

Otto Feik

9/28/2021 09:56:00 am

Is this a real thing here? Are people renting out their properties and not paying their assessments? That does not seem fair to all the other owners.
It sounds like leverage to get this 1 or 2 owners to pay up.

Poor Accounts Receivable Management

9/29/2021 03:13:54 pm

So from what I have heard, there are very few property owners who are behind on their dues. No idea if they are rental owners or not.
Regarding the issue of rental owners having to be caught up on their dues in order to obtain a Desert Princess Rental License;
This is the primary issue I have with this:
MOST of the people I know at Desert Princess have encountered issues with the accounting of their payments. It is an all to common story where accounting did not post payments on time (ie., they received the check days or weeks even before accounting for it; therefor incurring erroneous late fees) and/or where the check just was not applied at all. THIS IS A VERY COMMON SCENARIO.
So, until they can get their accounts receivable accurate and with minimal errors, they have no business imparting new rules with processes and systems that they themselves do not have a good handle on.

Terry

9/28/2021 04:35:58 pm

Thanks to the "leadership" here at DP our "resort" resembles a luxurious prison farm run by a authoritarian warden with compliant trustees willing to tow the line. There are some well intentioned individuals who unfortunately have no say about what happens here. The board cannot arbitrarily change the CC&Rs without a vote from the homeowners. What homeowner would agree and vote to eliminate the right to rent their home here at DP? That vote would devalue their property and greatly reduce their ownership flexibility. The board is way out over their skis on this one and should just throw in the towel since they cannot produce any evidence that renters are a huge liability here at DP. Some of our "leadership team" find it impossible to hide their contempt for homeowners who don't agree with their decisions or methods. We homeowners need a new direction and change of leadership.

Sam

9/28/2021 04:56:58 pm

It seems to me that the ability to rent units at DPCC short of long-term positively effects the overall value/equity for all units in the complex. Efforts to reduce rental viability via overuse of rules and restrictions would tend to reduce the value of all units in the complex.

9/28/2021 07:56:16 pm

You make a good point, but it could also be argued that numerous rentals could make DP seem like a transient community, which could negatively affect property values. I think property values are more affected by the overall care of the grounds, golf course, homes, and infrastructure. I think some of these areas need attention.

Terry

9/29/2021 09:32:38 pm

WG , DP may seem like a transient community to some but in truth it is a "well-heeled" transient community which I do not believe has a negative impact on property values. The more "utility" a property has the more valuable it is. Being able to rent our properties if desired increases the utility of the property and therefore increases the value. Property rights are an important element of our rights and need to be protected against onerous fees and fines which we are seeing proposed here at DP.

Bobby B

9/30/2021 11:01:00 am

The Zoom-only meeting that just concluded at 9:40 today, September 30, was a blatant exhibition of the Nazi regime that is alive and well and is running our board of directors. The vote of 6 to 1 (Bill Bergstrom was the only vote against this new punitive rental rule) has now established a new rule, effective immediately, that gives the HOA the power to suspend use of common area activities and rescind the right the homeowner has to rent his property if he has any outstanding fines or assessments, which marks him as a member who is not in good standing.

The good news is that California law has changed the rules about members who are not in good standing not being able to vote in an HOA election or ballot issue. All homeowners whether in good standing or not are now permitted to vote in an HOA election or ballot issue. That means that all those RENTAL HOMEOWNERS out there who just had their rights taken away should VOTE YES TO RECALL PETER WEBB and think about dumping the rest of those idiots who voted in favor of this topic with him and his henchwoman Terri Swartz--Norm Stoehr, Toshie Sweeney, Bob Mangold, Russ Holowachuk.

And does anyone have an answer as to why a Special Emergency HOA Meeting had to be called on this issue today? This couldn't wait until October's HOA open meeting? What's up with that?

It's time to rewrite the end of this chapter of the story, The Reign of Tyranny at Desert Princess--Hellish Fines, Fees and Foolishness. RECALL PETER WEBB and then we can take care of at least three more of them in the February 2022 election.

BSF

9/30/2021 12:50:23 pm

Could not have said that better Bobby.
This HOA board is a piece of work.

Zuzax

10/1/2021 07:48:24 pm

My comment is off topic above, so perhaps a new thread could be started. The board is considering closing some of the pools. This is unacceptable and I believe the homeowners need to make a preemptive move to stop this idea before it goes any further.

Dr. Kent Smalley

12/26/2022 07:34:58 am

Can anyone direct me to a reference supporting a civil suit that was filed concerning the co-mingling of funds between the HOA and the country club? I have been informed that a potential buyer cannot even obtain a commercial loan from a credit union because of it. I am familiar with the FannieMae and FreddieMac restriction (thanks HOA board) but had not heard about the separate civil issue. Any information would be appreciated.

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Charter

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A new Board rule targeting rental owners

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