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The Blog received this note from a homeowner:
My name is Rick. I am a Homeowner at Desert Princess. I had a 7:15 tee time and was playing 18 holes with a friend. After the first nine we stopped at the snack bar to get some food before finishing the second 9 holes. I was met at the Snack bar by Rand from the pro shop who screamed at me to “get back on the golf course immediately” and stating, “ there are people behind you”. I said, we are getting food and will resume playing. He then said get on the course immediately again. My response was that you have no right to talk to me that way. I have never been verbally accosted like that and was so upset I left the course and did not play the second 9 holes. I expect the golf staff to treat members and their guests in a professional manner. On any other course, the starter would have let the next group continue and schedule my second 9 after my break. I hope that the Country Club will handle this problem and address this unacceptable behavior from Rand, a Country Club employee. The Blog would like to know:
46 Comments
Stu Spencer
9/11/2021 09:04:28 pm
We have had this happen for many, many years. 9/12/2021 05:12:15 pm
I usually stay away from from him, seems to have a poor attitude’
Charles H Childress
9/11/2021 09:04:48 pm
If what you say is true he should receive an official warning from the HOA with very clear message not to do it again. Rude, and a revenue costing behavior.
Chet
9/11/2021 09:08:07 pm
I am a resident part-time at Desert Princess. I am not an active golfer but probably played a half a dozen times this year. I have always been treated well by the staff at the pro shop as well as the restaurant.
Stephanie Elzinga
9/11/2021 09:11:15 pm
This post is remarkably light on details. How long did it take you to play 9 holes? Were you behind? I have never seen anything but professional behavior from Rand. This is a golf course matter, not an HOA matter.
Change is needed at DPCC
9/12/2021 02:15:55 pm
Hi Stephanie,
Marc Rubenstein
9/11/2021 09:16:27 pm
Absolutely discussing! Unacceptable behavior for anyone to put up with…Rand should be terminated immediately! Another BIG FAIL HOA & Management company need to be held accountable to allow this to happen!
Maggie Hood
9/11/2021 09:53:05 pm
Completely unacceptable, as is the behavior of our present Board President and Fran in the office, now gone, who was always rude to me. Yet they regularly send out that email telling owners how we need to be polite. It needs to stop. Don’t our dues pay their salaries?
D C
9/11/2021 09:54:03 pm
Rick, Welcome to the HELL that Desert Princess has become
Art
9/11/2021 09:54:34 pm
The staff isn't very nice, and while we've not had this problem, it's clear how little the staff feels they need to be courteous and polite. What's worse for us, as homeowners without a cart, we can't golf in the afternoon because of the ridiculous rules about having carts back - back - by 2pm, so we don't play here, we play at Cimmaron instead. Having the carts back by 2pm means this course is missing out on money from our 4 rounds each time, but also losing money as a public course from others who would be here and need to rent a cart. You basically can only play morning rounds and if you don't have cart back in time they get pretty grumpy. We pay the HOA, but don't get benefit from the being able to play on the course where our home is because we can't play at our preferred time. It's stupid, they're leaving money on the table that's being scooped up by the neighboring course.
Change is needed at DPCC
9/11/2021 09:55:07 pm
My husband and his friends have also been accosted by Rand. And for no good reason. They were accused of not paying the correct amount when in fact they had already paid what they owed. Rand chased them out yelling at them and wrongfully accused them. When we got our statement, we had been double billed for the green fees. I honestly sympathize for Rand as he must clearly have a mental disorder. This is not normal behavior for a grown adult person to chronically exhibit. I hope he sees someone for anger management. I don't mean this sarcastically. I truly mean that from a good place. He clearly is not a happy person.
Change is needed at DPCC
9/12/2021 02:22:31 pm
Note
Summer
9/11/2021 11:58:26 pm
I’m relieved Rick chose to post this as I am also a homeowner who has also experienced exactly this type of unprofessional, nasty and upsetting treatment from Rand. His attitude is terrible and his customer service skills are non existent.
Barry Burgelin
9/12/2021 05:41:23 am
I completely understand, and sympathize, with Rick’s frustration. I (We) have had issues in the past with Club employees, and O’ Connell as well. That said, we have found that contacting a Supervisor with our issue or complaint has the best effect. Although in this case many would guess who the person was anyway, calling out the employee by name in a Forum , at least in my opinion, is not in the best interest of the Community. Management,( in this case Jerry Storage) has always been responsive in resolving these kinds of disputes. Rick, I hope you are able to find satisfaction. Sorry your golf round, and probably your day, was spoiled! Rand is a good guy, and we all make mistakes.😎
Ted
9/12/2021 03:44:13 pm
Barry, saying Rand is a good guy tells me you do not spend much time in the pro shop or golf on a regular basis. As far as speaking to Jerry Storage, he gets all his instructions from President Webb. Who we all know hasn't been to Desert Princess since becoming President. Many times Rand is rude or he doesn't speak to you when you go into the pro shop. Completely unacceptable.
Judge
9/13/2021 02:11:36 pm
Storage
Mike Johnson
9/12/2021 05:50:21 am
As long as Rick’s speed of play was ok then Rand was out of line and should apologize. Even if Rick was holding up the group behind him Rand could have dealt with the issue with a little tact and acted professionally. After all, we homeowners are paying his salary. 9/12/2021 06:41:20 am
I think what happened is totally unacceptable.
Manuel Quintillan
9/12/2021 07:16:47 am
Well this is one of those things, as a golfer you should be fully aware that your position on the course is immediately behind the group in front, yes respect will always be the preferable way to solve issues, I’m not sure if you are a repeat offender of slow play, if you are you need to find ways to speed up, there is lack of respect for golfers behind you, if you are not making efforts to keep pace . The halfway house is notoriously slow to serve golfers on the course it takes to long to get a hotdog or sandwich, perhaps they could take a look how others courses do it. Remember that we are all trying to have fun on the course with out ruining others fun time.
Long Time Homeowner
9/12/2021 07:37:50 am
Rand Veal has been at the DPCC entirely too long. He has ZERO customer service skills. He's a driving range guy. Sadly he feels his "authority" gives him license to treat people poorly. The management has been made aware of this for years and does nothing ,which is what they do best. After 20 years here we have finally had enough. We are selling our property and moving away. This place sadly is not getting better its getting worse. Rand is a blatant example of what's wrong here.
Judge
9/13/2021 02:12:42 pm
Why can't we vote these people out?
Douglas K Good
9/12/2021 08:18:17 am
I’ve been a home owner & golf member for the last 14 years & have a paper trail of 20+ emails, complaints etc about Rand Veal. For the last 7-8 years I don’t even go into the Pro Shop because golf is my entertainment & no ingrate who is an employee is going to treat me badly. The B of D for some reason have ignored his actions over & over again. To the gentleman who just experienced Rand’s latest display of despicable behavior? All I can say is recall Peter Webb & get Jerry Storage off his behind & discipline his employee!!! Unfortunately they all seem to be afraid, not sure Why? He’s only an employee who works for “US” the home owners.
Judge
9/13/2021 02:14:48 pm
Why don't we vote these people out?
Bruce
9/12/2021 08:28:00 am
Don’t think you’re gonna get many responses Sir. Rand runs the Pro shop & no one wants to be on his “List” as he has the power to reprimand. Good Luck !
Judge
9/13/2021 02:16:15 pm
Nice Bruce, you just answered my question. Home owners are afraid ?
New homeowner
9/12/2021 08:41:56 am
I have had a place that Desert Princess for just over a year and have played the golf course a handful of times. The last time I played I was with a friend and my 12-year-old son. I went into the golf shop and explained who is playing was given amount to pay which I did and we continued on to the golf course. Halfway through our first whole rant came out and started screaming at me about how I was trying to get away with not paying the proper fee for my son. I explained that I paid exactly what I was asked to pay. Both my friend and I were dumbfounded that a man of his age would have the audacity to conduct himself in such a manner in general nonetheless in front of a 12-year-old boy. I had no idea that this was a ongoing problem but this guy is out of line and should be relieved of his duties immediately. Someone who loses their temper here and there I can understand but clearly this guy has an anger management problem and that has no place on our golf course.
Drew
9/12/2021 10:43:46 am
As an educator of middle school students, it troubles me a great deal to hear of a 12 year old being witness to this type of tirade at our country club. I was just reading the blog to be informed. I'm not a golfer. If this has occurred, it should be addressed swiftly, and with consequences. We cannot be a respectable country club if employees are behaving like this in front of children. It is arguably emotional abuse, and it sets an unhealthy example when such behavior is allowed.
Christa
9/12/2021 08:56:56 am
I have been verbally abused by Rand twice. Once on the phone and once in person. I have witnessed him verbally abusing another customer in the golf shop. The first thing that came to my mind was “Oh, it’s not just me he talks to that way.” 9/12/2021 09:26:25 am
We only bought our house here in the spring. All of the staff have been very nice to us EXCEPT Rand. He screamed at me once too. I had my little shih tzu IN HIS DOGGY STROLLER when we first moved in (We are full timers) and I just wanted to enter the clubhouse to buy some golf clothes on sale there. I didn't see any no pets signs but that was on me. Ok so my mistake. But geeze... as soon as I walked in, Rand did not politely tell me "Oh hey, newcomer, no dogs sorry." He SCREAMED at me: "HEY!!! THAT DOG CANNOT BE IN HERE. GET THAT DOG OUT OF HERE." It was so rude! I was so embarrassed in front of the people there, especially being new. I thought he just had problems with women, screaming at me like that, but I see he screamed at Rick too. It has gotten to the point that we only try to go to Michael (the sweetest guy ever) to golf. If Rand is there I try to avoid him. He never even apologized. And he always seems mad or grumpy. So unprofessional. We bought our house to enjoy all the amenities. I don't want anyone to get fired, but someone should indeed speak with Rand and discuss these behavior issues. By all these comments, I see it is clearly, not just me. Thank you Rick for posting this.
Chance
9/12/2021 10:01:56 am
Sorry for your experience! Before we became full time residents we use to come out and rent . Every time we had to use the pro shop to pay for our tee times, we were ALWAYS treated poorly by 3 different employees. One is no longer there. Now as full time residents, attitudes really haven't changed in the pro shop, hoping as members it would. Always cringe when we need to go in.. Customer service is non existent. Maybe if there is a change in staff we could possibly have better revenue for our wonderful course.
Jeanette Morocco
9/12/2021 10:58:04 am
I am so sorry to the recipient of this behavior HOWEVER...there are always 2 sides to the story. I am not making excuses for this behavior , however , it would be nice to get Rand's side of the story before any judgement is passed. It's not easy keeping "play" moving in a reasonable time AND when it's slow moving due to slow or new golfers....well I am sure that the golf pro shop gets it's share of complaints !
Change is needed at DPCC
9/12/2021 02:26:09 pm
Dear Jeanette,
Brian J
9/12/2021 01:46:08 pm
As a relative newbie to DP, this thread combined with the recent behavior of the board makes me cringe. While, as someone said, there are two sides to every story; however, the multiple episodes reported here suggests this is not a one-off or isolated incident. Rather, it suggests an ongoing and pervasive disrespect toward homeowners and members. Has anyone ever addressed this with HR or others in charge? Also, I suggest that if this happens to anyone else that you stand your ground and not take the abuse; bullies thrive on intimidation, so let's remind who pays the salaries; who works for whom ultimately?
Terry
9/12/2021 05:06:39 pm
The numerous comments about Rand's unacceptable behavior and the fact that he is still employed at DP speaks volumes about the lack of leadership by the BOD and the Management Trust. Many homeowners at DP have mentioned Peter Webb's rude and contemptible behavior towards homeowners as well as other board members. There is too much evidence for it to be only "one side of the story." DP needs employees and leadership with well developed people skills at the very least. By the way, who in the hell hired Fran in the first place? Has she sued us yet?
Sully MacKenzie
9/12/2021 07:52:12 pm
I have personally been a victim of Rand’s abusive behavior and have seen him be rude to a complete stranger. I know of at least 3 golfers that have written letters to the board of directors/HOA complaining about Rand’s behavior. Which nothing was done (as Rand is still here) and I am sure the letters were “filed”. The president of the board at the time was Hank Kras who is an avid golfer and friend of Rand’s. Another cover up by Hank! If you recall Hank sent out an email last week supporting Peter Webb and reminding us of the great person Peter is and the fine job he is doing as a board member. It seems to me Hank covered by Rand’s behavior just like he is covering up Peter’s behavior.
Paul
9/12/2021 10:16:34 pm
Its amusing how all these guys cover each others butts. Who is kidding who? Peter is a nice guy. Are you kidding? There are a lot of things that could be said about him but that is not one of them.
Time for a change
9/12/2021 08:02:01 pm
It should be concerning to all of us that there are this many specific examples of Rand’s totally unacceptable behaviour. The fact that parents are tormented in front of their young children, OWNERS are too upset to continue their round, and gusts/public are disgusted and will never play here again. What more do we need to say this is an issue? I have fortunately never witnessed some of the irrational/unstable behaviour that others have, but I certainly have seen many times when Rand has made extremely sarcastic remarks to guests/renters/owners who are are not in the select group of <200 people who purchased a golf membership. My experience for the last decade+ has been that Rand absolutely bends over backwards for golf members and treats the rest in a casual manner at best, and with complete disrespect on too many occasions. Every other course in the valley treats ALL golfers with respect and tries to ensure that - guess what - you want to come back again! What a concept for a business. Rand is in a leadership position but does anything but lead by example. There was a comment that he is best suited to work on a driving range, Absolutely correct. There is no leadership or staff development there.
Stu Spencer
9/13/2021 09:58:50 am
We have had this experience from the beginning. Jerry Stirage is only concerned about the bottom line. As long as Rand makes his budget he gets a pass. It is true that DP has lost lots of potential revenue but they do not care. Rand is retiring at end of October. Hopefully whomever takes his place will be professional, we can only improve from here.
Mary Simmons-Maloney
9/15/2021 07:35:41 pm
I encourage all homeowners to pay close attention to the fee increase and the budget. We as homeowners SUPPORT the country club amenities! Our golf shop loses money EVERY DAY! It is not a money maker for our community. It SHOULD be offsetting our HOA dues, but instead we have to support their budget with our dues.
Robert
9/16/2021 06:58:26 pm
If true, sounds like Rand could have been more polite about the request to get back on the course. At the same time, you can’t just pause at the snack bar let a group or two pass, and then jump back in. That’s not how it works. If that did happen, the remaining groups playing through would all be delayed 10 minutes because of the backup. When that happens, the wrath of the delayed players will rain down on the pro shop staff. Sounds like Rand is retiring soon, and following that we’ll see how things play out.
David Dean
9/17/2021 08:30:39 am
I have had nothing but negative interactions with Rand since I've moved in. So much so that I doubt I will renew my golf membership. He is rude and at times abusive and personally I would like to see him dismissed. I hate to say that but I cannot remember an interaction with him where I have come away with a positive impression.
Tmsr
9/17/2021 10:22:26 pm
If all of the comments that I’ve read about this employee and the board that has done nothing to resolve these issues, then the board has to be recalled one by one.
D
9/18/2021 08:56:28 am
Agree. And after that junk that Norm Stoehr just sent out he should be next for recall right after Peter.
Laureen C.
9/19/2021 11:00:28 am
I completely agree with these comments about Rand. Even the other pros in the golf shop don’t like him or try to stay away from him. He is rude and unpleasant to deal with. And he doesn’t even try to be helpful. Also, why don’t we have a woman pro in the shop? I only see white men working there and that is not representative of the many, many women I see golfing here.
Takis P Vartelas
9/27/2021 05:00:16 pm
Well people, I've heard all your comments and of course the comments of two of my guests that also left the course because of Rand.
Bill
10/2/2021 05:42:34 am
Rick was playing in front of a tournament and countless other golfers. Him not making the turn in a timely manner would have affected numerous other golfers. I think Rick is the one who was being inconsiderate, and needs a lesson in etiquette. Your comment will be posted after it is approved.
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CharterThis blog is designed as a means to provide transparency and informative access to the policies and protocols of the Desert Princess Palm Springs Homeowners Association, the governance of the HOA Board of Directors and the management of the community’s assets by The Management Trust. The expressed intent is to establish a neighborhood hub for trusted connections and the exchange of helpful information, goods, and services; it is hoped that homeowners will use it to build a stronger and safer Desert Princess Palm Springs. PLEDGE
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